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#701 2017-11-20 13:30:37

Augur
Inebriated
Registered: 2012-08-23
Posts: 79

Re: Writing Status

3dsad    Sad news for us, but all that one can do is what one can do. Good luck in your life. Hope it gets better soon. It's been very quiet  for a while around here.

Last edited by Augur (2017-11-20 17:43:54)

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#702 2017-11-29 17:01:47

bleme
Tipsy
Registered: 2007-11-16
Posts: 9

Re: Writing Status

I first found CAMP on Usenet.  While your writing has definitely improved over the years, I think it is easier for people to imagine something like CAMP happening to them, which boosts its appeal.

And people should ease off Wesley Crusher.  He is a fellow homebrewer!

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#703 2017-12-01 03:51:34

nightsecho
Wasted
Registered: 2006-12-04
Posts: 162

Re: Writing Status

i found camp on igrrl (a sex stories site) in about 2001 or 2002 that led to emcsa then to ewp then here while not perfect it still holds a high place for me
I even have a copy of Taking on the World - an insanity fic by Enterprise and Net Wolf a camp crossover fic (not sure if you actually co wrote or not)
I've been a fan for awhile and will be for a long time to come


looking at you with wide eyes from the darkness

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#704 2017-12-01 07:26:33

Eric Storm
Pub Owner
From: New Port Richey, FL
Registered: 2006-09-12
Posts: 3987
Website

Re: Writing Status

We will not be discussing Taking on the World.  Yes, I was part of the project.  Yes, it contributed to my supposed departure from public life from 2002-2004.  No, I don't wish to relive that period.

Eric Storm


Please Remember:  The right to Freedom of Speech does not carry the proviso, "As long as it doesn't upset anyone."  The US Constitution does not grant you the right to not be offended.  If you don't like what someone's saying... IGNORE THEM.
----
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#705 2017-12-01 07:27:46

Eric Storm
Pub Owner
From: New Port Richey, FL
Registered: 2006-09-12
Posts: 3987
Website

Re: Writing Status

Oh yeah, you should also burn your copy of TotW.  If this means burning your entire PC, so be it.

Eric Storm


Please Remember:  The right to Freedom of Speech does not carry the proviso, "As long as it doesn't upset anyone."  The US Constitution does not grant you the right to not be offended.  If you don't like what someone's saying... IGNORE THEM.
----
AMEN! >>> Word Crimes

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#706 2017-12-03 09:30:27

nightsecho
Wasted
Registered: 2006-12-04
Posts: 162

Re: Writing Status

I haven't actually read Taking on the World but i did just get a new computer and destroyed an old one so mostly done 3dwink


looking at you with wide eyes from the darkness

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#707 2017-12-03 19:16:47

Eric Storm
Pub Owner
From: New Port Richey, FL
Registered: 2006-09-12
Posts: 3987
Website

Re: Writing Status

But you still have a copy of TotW, don't you?  Gotta burn the new computer...  misch_smiley

Eric Storm


Please Remember:  The right to Freedom of Speech does not carry the proviso, "As long as it doesn't upset anyone."  The US Constitution does not grant you the right to not be offended.  If you don't like what someone's saying... IGNORE THEM.
----
AMEN! >>> Word Crimes

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#708 2017-12-07 03:07:38

Crusader
Wasted
From: Madison, WI
Registered: 2007-07-19
Posts: 135

Re: Writing Status

O_o

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#709 2017-12-07 21:22:36

KaosKing
Inebriated
Registered: 2014-07-04
Posts: 20

Re: Writing Status

Or troll Eric by making an account and submitting it as a story? Purely joking, don't do that! lol.

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#710 2017-12-08 00:01:56

Eric Storm
Pub Owner
From: New Port Richey, FL
Registered: 2006-09-12
Posts: 3987
Website

Re: Writing Status

If anyone does, I will ban them...

AND YOU.

Eric Storm


Please Remember:  The right to Freedom of Speech does not carry the proviso, "As long as it doesn't upset anyone."  The US Constitution does not grant you the right to not be offended.  If you don't like what someone's saying... IGNORE THEM.
----
AMEN! >>> Word Crimes

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#711 2017-12-12 07:07:48

advancewar
Wasted
From: mass
Registered: 2007-02-05
Posts: 199

Re: Writing Status

i havent read it but now i want too ! 3dtongue


life=books

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#712 2017-12-12 08:03:34

Eric Storm
Pub Owner
From: New Port Richey, FL
Registered: 2006-09-12
Posts: 3987
Website

Re: Writing Status

Well, you're not going to.  Even if I was stupid enough to release it, there were only I think two chapters ever written.

Eric Storm


Please Remember:  The right to Freedom of Speech does not carry the proviso, "As long as it doesn't upset anyone."  The US Constitution does not grant you the right to not be offended.  If you don't like what someone's saying... IGNORE THEM.
----
AMEN! >>> Word Crimes

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#713 2017-12-13 15:47:45

advancewar
Wasted
From: mass
Registered: 2007-02-05
Posts: 199

Re: Writing Status

can i ask why you think its so bad? i dont think iv ever even heard of it till now. but i know your an exelent writer. been a fan since i found a few sporadic chapters of camp  on random sites


life=books

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#714 2017-12-13 19:27:57

Eric Storm
Pub Owner
From: New Port Richey, FL
Registered: 2006-09-12
Posts: 3987
Website

Re: Writing Status

Taking on the World was a story in which the authors' fictional characters came to life in the real world.... that was also a crossover... with an author who had created characters so powerful that they made Ron & Co. look ho-hum.

#1. I loathe crossover stories, unless the characters can actually be said to live in the same universe (such as my Justice Seven and Paladin characters).
#2. I have learned through hard lessons that characters that powerful are not useful in storytelling.  Life is too easy for them.
#3. The process of writing with another author was not successfully executed in this case.  In fact, I have attempted collaboration more than once.  It has never worked out for me.

Eric Storm


Please Remember:  The right to Freedom of Speech does not carry the proviso, "As long as it doesn't upset anyone."  The US Constitution does not grant you the right to not be offended.  If you don't like what someone's saying... IGNORE THEM.
----
AMEN! >>> Word Crimes

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#715 2017-12-14 03:19:52

Crusader
Wasted
From: Madison, WI
Registered: 2007-07-19
Posts: 135

Re: Writing Status

#2 can be very bad (in another world with my smart phone) they can also be awesome (one punch man)

Granted the 'awesome' tends to be the exception to the rule... because im sure i could find many more examples of the bad.

Edit:
Had to include the following example
Good: superman comics - he is protrayed with normal human problems, hella more interesting then the
Bad: superman movies

Last edited by Crusader (2017-12-14 03:25:05)

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#716 2017-12-14 09:02:34

Eric Storm
Pub Owner
From: New Port Richey, FL
Registered: 2006-09-12
Posts: 3987
Website

Re: Writing Status

But consider then that those plots could take place for any human.  The part of him that makes Superman "unique", his power, is... simply too powerful.  The truth is that if the superheroes and supervillains of either DC or Marvel actually existed, civilization would have been completely wiped out like ten times over by now.  Ron & Co. were too powerful: it became too easy for them to do everything except defeat the bad guys.  Admittedly, good guy vs. bad guy is a viable conflict, but... it gets old really fast.

This is one of the reasons I've endeavored to make David more limited in his abilities.  There are things he's not good at.  There are things that wizards can't do.  Now, I grant you, he's still one hell of a kick-ass character, but Ron would likely wipe the floor with him... or just drop a building on him.  Of course, even David has a plot-killing trait: he's immortal.  I probably should have given him a way to be destroyed.  It's very hard to worry too much about a character who cannot die.  I hope that at least some people were concerned about what would happen after he got shot...

Eric Storm


Please Remember:  The right to Freedom of Speech does not carry the proviso, "As long as it doesn't upset anyone."  The US Constitution does not grant you the right to not be offended.  If you don't like what someone's saying... IGNORE THEM.
----
AMEN! >>> Word Crimes

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#717 2017-12-14 17:11:15

Crusader
Wasted
From: Madison, WI
Registered: 2007-07-19
Posts: 135

Re: Writing Status

I remembering thinking he would come back with some type of mental disability, or having lost all/most/some of his memories after his death (I.E. wolverine getting shot in the head in "X-Men Origins: Wolverine"), and expecting a few months of mental rehab.
But now that i'm thinking about it again, if you exclude magic... and that's a big thing to exclude in this case ... then an argument could be that David shouldn't be able to accrue new memories as of his death.
Given that memories are neurons firing over and over again, becoming able to fire easier, because David can't change, the neurons would always stay in the state they were on death...

This is kind of shown in a Movie from 2010 called "Let Me In" with the vampire in it never mentally growing up.

All that being said, I much prefer the idea that undead can mentally change, because I would hate to be mentally locked at a specific age for the rest of eternity.

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#718 2017-12-14 17:43:43

HJP1993
Inebriated
From: Baytown, Texas
Registered: 2008-01-06
Posts: 21

Re: Writing Status

"It's very hard to worry too much about a character who cannot die.  I hope that at least some people were concerned about what would happen after he got shot..."

I was a bit worried, as Crusader mentioned, memory loss, mental disability, and long-term rehab are all obvious possibilities when brain damage is considered. As far as neurons being in the same state, then depending on how far you take that you could be stuck in the instant of your death forever, after all sensory input (visual, feeling, etc.) as well as reactions to them (emotions and movement) all require neurons to change. A bit less extreme and you'd still be stuck with no long term memory (think 10 second Tom from 50 First Dates lol).

There are many things worse than death, some have been shown. P..., gotta look it up, Pendergrast! is trapped in a house, David's friends/loved ones (is there a generic word for people you care about?) are being lethally assaulted in bizarre ways that he's barely able to counter, and there's a looming threat of war that he believes will directly impact his home..... If he was trapped then someone could easily take advantage of that to do more than just leave him bored, getting shot in the head every time you recover would be nearly as maddening as being stuck with someone lecturing you that Pacifism and never being angry is the only way to live. Or he could be given drugs that affected him negatively, pixie stick anyone? And none of that even really involves magic or people he cares about turning against him for some reason (or taken to the extreme, everything he knows and owns being stripped from him for some reason and having to start over, even in a "positive" way, eg. infiltrating another country).

Just because you're immortal doesn't mean you have nothing to worry about, even if there isn't some Kryptonite to make you mortal.....

Last edited by HJP1993 (2017-12-14 17:44:13)

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#719 2017-12-14 18:46:39

Eric Storm
Pub Owner
From: New Port Richey, FL
Registered: 2006-09-12
Posts: 3987
Website

Re: Writing Status

Okay, just taken from the standpoint of, "The book is written in a month-per-chapter system":  Did you really want to read 3-6 chapters of David going through mental rehab?  I sure as hell didn't want to write them...

As to "no memories after death":  Let's take this line of thinking to its logical conclusion.  You wouldn't, in fact, be able to utter a single sentence.  In fact, you wouldn't be able to do anything at all.  Everything requires neurons to fire and to change.  This is, of course, assuming that the brain is actually in control of the soul, a concept that is completely invalidated by the premise of the universe, which is that the soul exists intact after the death of the body, and is sent to Haven.  So, from a universe standpoint, neurons are completely irrelevant to memory, thought, or anything else that is a purely mental endeavor.  If what you're suggesting were the truth, then ghosts, too, would not be able to form memories after they die, because they no longer HAVE neurons.  But this isn't the way it works in the Dugerra universe.

Further, as I have explained previously, David's body functions through magic.  He has no blood within him; this fact alone makes any "normal" form of existence impossible.  But he is now a magical creature, and the things he is able to do are supported through magic, not biology.

And as to the idea of David losing everything being worse than death:  Realize that, sooner or later, David will lose everyone he knows right now.  He will outlive everyone who is currently alive.  He will outlive the kingdom he has pledged loyalty to.  Conceivably, he will outlive the planet on which he is standing.  Will he outlive the universe?  That's... a question for another time.  But the fact is that, faced with something like war, David simply isn't in the kind of danger that a normal protagonist would be.  He can fail, but he can't be killed.  And truthfully, failure is NOT worse than death, people just like to be melodramatic.  If you're still alive, you can always attempt to rectify the failure.

Eric Storm


Please Remember:  The right to Freedom of Speech does not carry the proviso, "As long as it doesn't upset anyone."  The US Constitution does not grant you the right to not be offended.  If you don't like what someone's saying... IGNORE THEM.
----
AMEN! >>> Word Crimes

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#720 2017-12-14 20:50:21

HJP1993
Inebriated
From: Baytown, Texas
Registered: 2008-01-06
Posts: 21

Re: Writing Status

No lol (speaking for general immortal characters) though with less impact on the reader it could be done in one chapter and simply stated that it takes x months, basically the chapter would be made up of a recovery montage instead of the typical training montage. In theory this means that the audience would know that the character could face severe consequences even though they couldn't actually die.

right as Crusader said "if you exclude magic... and that's a big thing to exclude in this case". I was just stating that the "no changes after death" scale can go all the way from "women just can't get pregnant" to "hair and nails don't grow" to "you can't mentally or physically mature" to "no new memories" to "practically indistinguishable from the dead". It's up to the author to pick a point where their story fits on that line (which can then be slightly... changed, eg. in Anita Blake vampire hair can't grow, unless you have a lot of power like the "Master of the City", and I'm sure there's a few stories where vampires manage to breed in extremely rare scenarios).

Yes, due to being immortal he would outlive every mortal person (though the ones that matter are only those he forms attachments to), assuming he can't or won't make them immortal as well. However without external interference that will happen over a "lifetime" and he will have a little time to adjust to the fact that he will lose them as they get older and accept their own deaths, and it'd be over a span of years. He will also be capable of forming new attachments with others, perhaps even their children or even his own (can't remember if that's been explicitly stated, but even so there are less biological options for those inclined). That's a different thing from having everyone you know killed over the course of a few weeks, days, or hours. Especially if you're there but helpless to stop them and/or they're dying in a very painful manner. Though the obvious solution to that is to not form attachments with mortals, only other immortals.

And sure, theoretically an immortal can outlive a planet, or even the universe, but I find it terribly difficult to imagine any previous mortal choosing to do so unless they had memory loss which prevented them from remembering everything they've lost and becoming bored with what they've seen time after time. I suppose it's possible, particularly if you like finding conflicts (of various sorts) to engage in or particularly enjoy some job/hobby (creating new potions, spells, etc.) but... perhaps I simply have not lived long enough to understand the desire to live forever.

"If you're still alive, you can always attempt to rectify the failure." - there are some things that can not be fixed or changed, though you can sometimes still do something about it, ie. take revenge.

Though, you're correct that an immortal does not face an existential risk as a mortal does. We have no worries that he will die and the series will end with no one left to follow, or at least no one we care about (cough, Game of Thrones). But just because the familiar risk is not present does not mean that there is no risk.

Last edited by HJP1993 (2017-12-14 20:50:47)

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#721 2017-12-15 07:32:05

fathertyme
Inebriated
From: Second star to the right
Registered: 2009-02-18
Posts: 82

Re: Writing Status

ok.. hypothetical question (even knowing I'll get slammed for it)

If somehow, someone was able to create a device, or cast a spell, etc.. that caused an area to have NO magic at all... what would happen to magical creatures like David?

I have read at least 2 different books where a weapon of this sort was used to kill all magical creatures within the radius of the bomb..

since David would not exist without magic....

(my mind comes up with this crap when I'm tired and I end up posting it before coming to my senses *L*)

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#722 2017-12-15 08:28:55

Eric Storm
Pub Owner
From: New Port Richey, FL
Registered: 2006-09-12
Posts: 3987
Website

Re: Writing Status

HJP1993 wrote:

No lol (speaking for general immortal characters) though with less impact on the reader it could be done in one chapter and simply stated that it takes x months, basically the chapter would be made up of a recovery montage instead of the typical training montage.

You apparently missed the part of my post (and the basis of the last six books) where I point out that the story is written one chapter per month of story time.  There is no "skipping ahead" for more than a week or two.  Each book has 12 chapters, representing one year of David's life.  The only book that is likely to change this format is the last one, which will probably have a "Chapter 13", to wrap things up.

fathertyme wrote:

If somehow, someone was able to create a device, or cast a spell, etc.. that caused an area to have NO magic at all... what would happen to magical creatures like David?

What would happen if someone created a device or spell where no electromagnetism existed?  Or no gravity?  Answer:  You can't.  These are the fundamental building blocks of the universe.  Magic is exactly the same.  You can prevent the performance of magic in an area... but you can only do that by using magic, so you have not removed magic, you have only restricted it.  If it was possible to do what you're asking about, it would tear a large, sucking hole in the universe, and everything would come to a screaming end.  Even black holes don't remove any of the fundamental building blocks.  They just kind of twist them out of shape.

NOTE FOR THE NITPICKY:  Just because no photons are passing through a segment of space doesn't mean that electromagnetism does not exist there.  It's just not in use.  Likewise, gravity exists everywhere, even if it isn't affecting anything within a certain cube of space.  It's still "available", it's just not in use.  The question was about preventing the existence of a fundamental force within a region, not just its natural absence.

Eric Storm


Please Remember:  The right to Freedom of Speech does not carry the proviso, "As long as it doesn't upset anyone."  The US Constitution does not grant you the right to not be offended.  If you don't like what someone's saying... IGNORE THEM.
----
AMEN! >>> Word Crimes

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#723 2017-12-15 12:45:33

HJP1993
Inebriated
From: Baytown, Texas
Registered: 2008-01-06
Posts: 21

Re: Writing Status

Eric Storm wrote:

You apparently missed the part of my post (and the basis of the last six books) where I point out that the story is written one chapter per month of story time

Not to be rude but you apparently missed the part of my post where I point out

HJP1993 wrote:

speaking for general immortal characters

Not your story in particular, beyond which it's not unheard of for authors to change things when it suits their purposes. And just because you choose not to do it in this scenario doesn't mean it does not apply to other authors writing other immortal characters in other stories. As such, it is a potential worry (until it's confirmed otherwise), just like you could invent some way for David to, practically, "die" even if just by trapping him in Haven with no (timely) escape some how. Low as that chance may be, it is theoretically possible and so there is some fleeting worry just for those; Let alone the other slightly more likely consequences.

But once you want to take into account the chances of a creator choosing to kill off their main character (in a way that they can't come back), particularly when they don't have strong characters already helping them do things to carry on the story, then that worry doesn't exist with almost any work at all; It's just not done (of course exceptions etc). Which then invalidates the entire discussion here which is entirely based on the fact that David is immortal and you can't worry about him dying even though practically every work provides the main character(s) with immortal level plot armor.
---
As for a magic-destruction bomb, the idea came to me as well (though less weaponized) so nice to hear how that would(n't) work out in WA (:

Last edited by HJP1993 (2017-12-15 13:07:45)

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#724 2017-12-15 13:15:57

Crusader
Wasted
From: Madison, WI
Registered: 2007-07-19
Posts: 135

Re: Writing Status

HJP1993 wrote:

right as Crusader said "if you exclude magic... and that's a big thing to exclude in this case". I was just stating that the "no changes after death" scale can go all the way from "women just can't get pregnant" to "hair and nails don't grow" to "you can't mentally or physically mature" to "no new memories" to "practically indistinguishable from the dead". It's up to the author to pick a point where their story fits on that line (which can then be slightly... changed, eg. in Anita Blake vampire hair can't grow, unless you have a lot of power like the "Master of the City", and I'm sure there's a few stories where vampires manage to breed in extremely rare scenarios).

+1 ... should i have used dumb instead of big, or added it after for 'big dumb'?

No i would not have wanted to read months of rehab, and i never said this would make a great story. I hate vampire stories where the character can not mentally progress, doesn't mean i dont think of this each time an undead of some kind is presented. But you asked if we were worried. I was worried about memory loss, effectively restarting the character would have been a bit jarring.

"You wouldn't, in fact, be able to utter a single sentence.  In fact, you wouldn't be able to do anything at all.  Everything requires neurons to fire and to change."

Well that would make a piss poor story. 84 chapters of the MC sitting there not moving, doing nothing. Almost all fictional stories with magic or scfi have a bit of hand waiving at science. Where the hand waiving line is depends on the story. And the month following the headshot gave the line more definition as to where it is. As the story is following david, that point could have been: 'The End'

I would have a bit flabbergasted.

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#725 2017-12-16 04:29:31

KaosKing
Inebriated
Registered: 2014-07-04
Posts: 20

Re: Writing Status

While David can't actually die, he can go insane. He is still vulnerable, even if it isn't his own life is at risk. The lives of everyone he loves, is. Hence why all of his loved ones are getting targeted.

He can also theoretically be cursed or bound like Jacob (Though it may be difficult, as I am of the opinion that is it extremely likely David is a superior spellcaster to Jacob, and I can't recall if we have materials stating one way or the other, just gut instinct.)

Sorry, overall point being David is in fact a lot more interesting than Ron.

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